I recently realized that I have a very strict routine when it comes to reading and reviewing books. But I see so many other bloggers who DON’T have a strict routine, so I’m wondering if there are any bloggers out there like me?
First, I’ll talk you through my reading and reviewing process!
My Reading and Reviewing Process
- First, I pick a new book to read. It’s a very careful and selective process, but maybe that will be for another post. 😉
- Then, I draft my blog post. I do this before I even start the book! (Unless I’m like on an airplane or a train, etc. when I’m starting a new book.) I fill out all the book information, write in the synopsis, upload the cover image.. the whole deal! Everything except the review!
- I read the book! Obviously. If I’m reading in my Kindle then I highlight important passages or quotes I want to use in my review. If I’m reading a physical copy, then I sometimes take notes while I read. I don’t do it often, but it’s important if I need to address something very specific in my review or if I want to quote a certain passage. Plus I need to brainstorm quotes for my graphics!
- Immediately after I finish reading, I write my review. I absolutely CANNOT start another book until I’ve written my review. Otherwise my thoughts will get polluted and won’t be as focused. My reviews always feel more genuine if I can express my thoughts and feelings immediately after finishing!
- Side Note: I always use the HTML editor in WordPress (instead of the visual editor). I have the visual editor completely turned off. I know it’s because I’m a coder and it makes sense to use your own HTML if you know it because then you have more control over the layout… but I’ve never seen anyone else do this! Am I all alone?? Is there someone else out there??
- After the review is written, I start working on the graphics. This includes a slider banner and my “Word Rating” graphic, which I sometimes customize to be in the style of the book cover.
- Then I preview my review about a million times.
- Then I schedule my review, and I also post the review immediately up on Goodreads and LibraryThing (and Amazon if the book has already been released, otherwise I schedule when to post it on Amazon on Google Calendar).
- Then, finally, I’m free to pick and read another book.
If I don’t follow this exact schedule, things go wrong. I freak out a little, I worry about missing a step, etc. But more than that, it’s become a process and a routine that I’ve come to love! I get excited about starting a new book, about filling in the book info, about drafting a new post, or writing a review. I love the steps and it pleases me when I follow them! Is that weird?
But the most important things to me are:
- I cannot read two books at once.
- I cannot start reading a new book before I’ve written my review of the previous one.
I literally don’t know how some people get by with writing reviews days or even weeks later, especially if they start reading new books in that time! How do they keep the facts straight? My emotions are always highest right after I finish reading, so if I write my review then, then I think those emotions are more likely to show in the review itself.
“Immediately after I finish reading, I write my review. I absolutely CANNOT start another book until I’ve written my review. Otherwise my thoughts will get polluted and won’t be as focused. ” OMG THIS IS SO ME! After reading the book, I rush to my computer and write my review asap. But.. I like reading 2 books or more at once. I think it’s cause I don’t want the other book to end so I purposefully want to read it longer by reading other books in between.
Leigh @ Little Book Star
OMG YES! High five!!!
Although I can’t read 2 books at once, I do understand where you’re coming from! It makes sense that you wouldn’t want the book to end, so you prolong the process! 🙂
Wow, that is OCD. But I get it because I am OCD about a lot of things. But actually, not with my blog. I want my blog to be a fun thing for me so I am more laid back about it. Here is my routine:
I read all books for blog tours and review requests about 2 or 3 weeks ahead of time.
Then I read books for my own enjoyment in between. I pick them randomly based on my mood.
Though I want to change this, I write my posts only a day or two early. I just can’t seem to get ahead of myself with all my other stuff going on.
So it can be a month later when I write my review of a book I have read.
I take notes while I read. But I usually don’t need them. I remember every book I read and everything I hated or love about it. I actually write better reviews when I give the book reading experience time to breathe before I jump into the review. On the rare occasions where I had to reread some of the book to remind myself of it, I take it as a sign that the book wasn’t memorable and I rate it accordingly.
I guess that’s not really a routine but just an observation of my blogging motions.
One weird thing though is you know how I have a review format: the good, the bad, the snuggly and all that jazz. Well, I always do the good last. I have to know what I wrote on the bad and the snuggly first so I wont accidently add it with my good section.
The only thing I do really early sometimes is the book info, cover, blurb, and so on. Getting the bare bones of the post done early makes me feel good because when I go to write my review I want to focus on that, not putting the essentials together.
I think I should get an award for longest comment ever. 🙂
I totally don’t get how you can write your review a month after reading the book! Does not compute!! LOL!
I do think it’s interesting how you always write the good bit first. I guess it totally makes sense though!
And long comments for the win!!!
Seems very similar to me lol. Everything except the graphics. 😛 I absolutely have to write my review immediately after reading the book. Don’t care if it’s on my laptop, on my little notebook in my purse or my cellphone. I can’t wait a few days like a lot of people do.
As for the HTML, I do half and half. I write it in the visual editor and edit some lay-out stuff in the HTML editor. 😛
*high five*! It’s so cool that we both do that. 😀
Switching between the visual editor and HTML editor scares me! *hides*
I’m not as good in HTML as you are, so I have to switch. 😛
Oh and to scare you more, we have a very very similar taste in books. Whenever I check out a book, I read your review and if it’s positive, I just buy it because I know I’ll love it too when you did. 😛 And I’ve never been wrong. Scary, huh?
Wow that’s awesome! 😀 I’m glad to hear that! It’s cool that our tastes line up so well!
Yeah it is. 🙂
I can only read and review one book at a time too! I tried reading two at once before but I ended up being confused when I wrote the reviews… And since English isn’t my native language I read my reviews over and over until I’m sure about the grammar… Reviewing has turned me into a slightly OCD person and it makes me freak out whenever I see a typo or grammar mistakes.
Which reminds me that I spotted a mistake earlier so I gotta fix that soon!
Yeah I hate typos and grammar mistakes too!
I think you have a great process going! I would love to be able to adhere to a process like this one, but I’m afraid it would make my blog start feeling too much like work (and it’s a very new hobby for me). I actually do have draft posts started for all the books I’m reading right now (different genres, so I don’t get mixed up) so maybe I’m a little more O.C.D. than I thought. 🙂 I also take plenty of notes when reading, either for things for the review or things I’d like to research.
And I almost exclusively use the HTML editor! And preveiw/proofread a milliion times.
Yeah if something more relaxed works for you, that’s great! I think we should all do everything we can to make blogging fun and not feel like a job!
I take notes too, when reading, and the highlighting in Kindle. But sometimes, I forget to refer to it. 😛
And I’m such a cheater, I can totally read two to three books at the same time. I’m doing that right now.
But I’m going to do what you do when a book isn’t on Amazon and mark that stuff into my Google Calendar. It’s about time I start posting more on Amazon.
Maybe I should also follow your example when it comes to writing reviews and stop procrastinating on them . . .
I’ve honestly been slacking lately on Amazon too.. I used to be SO good at posting all my reviews there, but I’ve started slipping a little!! Must fix this!
That is a little OCD 😛 No, I don’t do it that way, but I do have a little OCD in me. For starters, I have TWO (not one, two) day planners: one i use for scheduling the posts and one to write down reviews. I feel I can describe what I feel about a book better using pen and paper, rather than writing them directly on my computer. I have a pretty good memory though, so I don’t mix up my books even if I write the review two weeks after reading a book (if I had the same awesome memory for my classes and exams, I’d be a happy camper *pout*). It takes a little longer to write the review on the blog, what with constantly checking what I wrote on my planner, but I type fast 😛 I don’t write the review right after I finish the book though. I can’t explain it, but I need a little time to sort out my feelings and thoughts. Otherwise my review would be full of “omg, that’s so awesome/that wasn’t good” and some other things like that.
I don’t use html though. I don’t know it that well, and after 4 years of intensive computer science where we had to know C++ like we knew our home addresses, I’m kind of weary of learning another rather complex language. Also, I can’t learn something if I don’t see someone doing it and explaining me every little detail, so I’m pretty sure I can’t do it by myself *pout*
I think I write better reviews if I wait a day or two after I finish a book because it gives me time to process things. But there’s no way that I can wait a week or more because otherwise I will forget important things that I want to write.
I know that some bloggers have reading schedules. I admire that because I’ve tried that and failed miserably… I don’t know how they can do that! I am such a mood reader that I can never pre-plan what books I read when. I end up choosing my next book after I finish one.
I try to read a maximum of three books at a time, but even that gets me kind of anxious, and I end up trying to rush to finish one. I generally do two books at a time just in case I’m not in the mood for one. (Geez, I sure am moody! Haha!)
Although I don’t have quite the same process that you do, I definitely agree that my reviews are more detailed and authentic when I write them right after I finish a book. Sometimes I do mini reviews of books that I read but didn’t immediately write a review for just so I can get my overall impression out there. I’m OCD about a lot of things in life, but strangely, my blog is not one of them. Great post!
We’re pretty similar, I guess! I draft my blog post before even reading the book, as well and I need to write the actual review very soon after I’ve finished the book. If the book is not fresh in my mind I won’t know what to write in my review at all! My memory is awful. But I do sometimes wait to post it and then change and add some things in the review a few days later.
I’m not OCD when I read. I can read more than one book at once and read another book right after I finish a book without writing a review because I take notes every time I read.
However, like you, I always use the HTML editor in WordPress instead of the visual one. The visual editor drives me CRAZY with all the white space and pictures appearing instead of the HTML text verison of it. Like you, I’m more comfortable with HTML. So don’t worry Ashley, you’re not alone with that one. ;D
I used to be very punctual and systematic with my reviews and I couldn’t either how could bloggers just put off their reviews but now I realise how difficult it is to keep up because there is so much stuff to do, blog-related or not. I do try to write my reviews immediately after I finish a book but lately, it’s been hard to find the mood to do so.
I also used to not read more than two books at once, one physical and one ebook but now I’ve started to be a rebel haha and let myself read more. It is bothering me inside but as long as I’m going to get them read and have a timeline for myself, I’m okay with it.
I always use the Visual Editor 😛 Sometimes things don’t turn out the way I want it so I switch to HTML to tweak it here and there but for me I’m a very visual person so I need to see how my post is going to look as I edit it.
I am actually the type that reads more than one at once. I like to have 2 going at one time–and to keep things straight I write down my thoughts either on paper or in my future post. Like you I like to have it all prepped for the review to be written. I always take notes write after I read to get those feels out but I do wait sometimes to get all the other stuff finalized. Some books I actually need to take a couple days before I write the review to get my thoughts straight. I love reading about everyone’s process, great post!
My Friends Are Fiction
I also NEED to write my review immediately after I’m finished reading, or at least before I start a new book. If it’s really late at night, I might wait until the morning to write the review but, like you, I can’t begin a new book before I write my review for the previous one.
I really wish I was like you. My life would certainly be easier! I am a note taker, so that has helped some, but writing the review right after reading the book would make life so much easier. I have started implementing a new thing, where I make the blog post as I start the book. Throughout the reading, I go into the post and write thoughts. When I’m finished, I have a good rough draft. It is working out well so far. 🙂
I absolutely code my own posts too 🙂 But I use Movable Type – not WP or Blogger. The visual editor (and this includes Windows Live Writer) puts in so much extraneous code, and I can’t stand the mess! I’m also a little OCd – but I don’t take notes while I read … mine is more of a book discussion not necessarily a review. I also write my thoughts immediately, publish it on Goodreads – just in case I don’t start writing it up on my blog right away.
I also try to have a backlog of “reviews” so I can take my time and add images, look over my thoughts etc.
Okay so this is what I do:
Step 1: Finish the book (I cannot start the review without finishing the book)
Step 2:Write the review (cover,important book info,synopsis & your review)
Step 3: Preview it.
Step 4: Either post it or schedule it (Depending on if I have any other posts planned that day)
Step 5: Post it on Amazon & Good Reads (yes in that order)
My OCD carries throughout my life but I’ve really noticed it in the above steps. If I don’t do it in those exact steps,I freak out a bit.
Thanks for linking up with Let’s Discuss! 🙂
I definitely have a similar routine, especially the part about getting the skeleton of the review ready before I actually read the book. It’s like pre-gaming! Look at the cover, read the synopsis again, get all excited to read it… it’s great!
I never EVER used to read 2 books at a time. The only exception to this that I’ve made is allowing myself to be ‘reading’ an audiobook at work, so that way I can read while at work without getting in trouble 😀
I have to finish my review before picking up my next book, too! It may not be 100% done, but it’s written, all of my thoughts are there, and it just may need some editing for typos. I did get horribly behind on posting them to Amazon and Goodreads, but my goal for the weekend is to catch up.
I also do my own HTML. I am not definitely not a coder, but I know the basics and I find that doing it myself makes sure it looks how I intended.
And I know you didn’t mean anything by it, but I really don’t think OCD is a term that should be thrown around lightly just to mean that you’re organized or like things a certain way. I’ve had to deal with it my entire life (my mom has to have anxiety meds to control hers) and it’s a lot more than just being neat and tidy. I cringe every time says that they’re “OCD about [something]” because it’s not something you pick and choose. I don’t mean to pick on you, but I just had to get that out!
Angie I am moderately OCD myself. It is SUCH a hard thing to deal with and I don’t think Ashley was being flippant about it.
I know she wasn’t, but I think people forget that it is a real disorder and just throw it around like it’s something…I don’t know…that makes them special? It’s become such a common place thing, kind of like how people say “retarded” instead of “stupid.” I know it’s not quite the same, but it’s similar.
I apologize, I didn’t mean to downplay people who actually have the disorder! I can understand how that would be frustrating for you. 🙁
You might cringe when you hear my routine. I am in a review slump right now, so I have read like four books that need reviews, and I am reading another. It can be confusing, so I take vigorous notes while reading in my notebook and Kindle app. I then refer to these notes whilst writing reviews weeks later. It really sucks when I do that, because I lose the excitement about it. Perhaps I should just push myself to stop delaying writing reviews.
The HTML editor must feel so natural to you, but I find myself still needing to Google tags and stuff sometimes. It certainly offers you more room for manipulation and precision though, which the visual editor lacks. Thanks for sharing your quirks, and linking them up via Let’s Discuss!
I have no idea how you can keep up with that! 😀 If I had like 4 unwritten reviews, I have NO idea how I’d be able to go back and write them. I feel like I’d have forgotten all the important details by then, or I’d mix them together D:
I am the least OCD person about reading ever. I write reviews when I feel like it, I usually have 2+ books going at the same time (one on each device usually). My reviews usually go up the day after writing them. I am so disorganized and such a procrastinator, and for me organizing the way I respond to a book feels weird. It works for some people, but not for me 🙂 I’m just really weird though, so that’s probably it!
I do pretty much everything differently from the way you do it 😀
I usually write my own synopsis, so I can’t really do that before I read the book. But I do fill out the book information and enter the cover before I start reading- that way I feel like I’ve accomplished something before I start reading the book, and I have kind of a reminder on my blog about writing the review.
I sometimes write the review straight after reading the book, but sometimes, I need a couple of days before I can – because some books leave me an emotional mess, and I don’t want to blabber on, I want to be more or less coherent in my reviews 😀
I usually start a new book straight away, too, though, even if I haven’t written my review yet. Because I read almost only exclusively on my kindle, so I have loads of highlights if I’m afraid of forgetting something.
Once my review is written, I schedule it, but I always make sure the review is posted on my blog before I post in anywhere else, and I link to my blog stating that is where the review was originally posted. And I only use the text editor if I need to enter html – and as you know, I’m not very good at that, so I mostly use the visual editor.
I have also recently started to make some graphics, but I’m not very good at it yet 🙂 I am having a lot of fun playing with it, though.
(Did I beat Jennifer for long comment?)
Practice makes perfect with graphics! 😀
And your comment certainly rivals Jennifer’s!
It’s so funny, I was *just* thinking about writing a similar post the other day!
I definitely have a very set way of doing things when it comes to reading and writing reviews for my blog. It sounds as though we have an almost identical process! Before I being reading a book I set up the ‘bare bones’ for the post, complete with all the introductory information, book cover, etc. I take extensive notes as I read. Like you, if I’m reading a book on my Kindle I highlight important passages and quotes that I intend on using in my review, and if I’m reading a book in print I use sticky notes to mark the pages with quotes that I want to type up when I’m finished. I jot down notes as I read, which span from the most basic information like my initial impressions of a character (i.e. He’s pedantic, rigid, uncompromising, etc) as well as any themes I might want to address in my review. I also touch upon any problems I had when I experience them, lest I forget them later on. I write my reviews immediately after I finish reading, and cannot pick up a new book until the prior review is finished. Every time I’ve tried to do otherwise, I’m always left with a half-completed review. It’s quite a time-consuming process and often limits the number of books I can read in one week because it depends on how easily I’m able to draft the rough copy of the review, but it’s the only way that seems to work for me.
I’m the same way! I cannot start a new book before I review the one I just read. I don’t understand how people do this and keep all the details and characters straight. There’s so many books that I read prior to starting my blog that I want to review, but I have to re-read them before I feel comfortable enough to write my review or else I feel like the quality just won’t be on par with the rest of my reviews. I also cannot read more than one book at a time. Again, the details just get too confusing and mixed up if I try. Great post!
I only ever use HTML editor, but I’ve been making websites for years and I know it like the back of my hand. I agree it’s easier to format it that way.
I take notes in a little Moleskine or on Goodreads when I do my progress posts. Sometimes I won’t write a review until months after reading it! I somehow manage to get my facts straight, but notes definitely helps 🙂
/I wish I as a bit more OCD with my reading and reviewing. I have the opposite issue of Book ADD. I start books, read about 5 at a time, start reviews after I read the book but don’t finish it until 3 books later. So yeah I need a bit of our OCD.
So glad I’m not the only one OCD-ing over here! I’m definitely the same as you, especially the drafting part. I feel somehow, I don’t know, happy (?) when I drafted my post. It just fell kinda wrong when I read a book and the post is not drafted yet. And yep, I preview my post gazillion times 😀
Although, maybe, I don’t write fully in HTML. I would definitely go bald in no time if I did. I did the basic layout with visual ones, and then tweak the HTML every here and there, previewpreviewpreview for another countless time, and then mixed my writing between the visual and tweaking the HTML 😀
I’m sooo envious you could write in fully HTML 0.0 Sometimes when I write in Visual, the draft and the actual post didn’t looked the same, and then I die a little inside.
But nice post as always, Ashley!
Neysa @ [B.O.O.K.L.I.F.E]
My process isn’t as strict as yours, but we do have a couple things in common! I also draft my post before I even start reading the book. I like being able to go right into my review with fresh thoughts, as opposed to wasting time filling out all the info.
I do take notes, as well. (Although, my notes have turned into “reaction style” notes, haha.)
I think I’m completely the opposite, haha. I always admire people who can stick with one book, because I just can’t.. I love reading several books at the same time. When I’m busy, I try to keep it with 2 books. When I’m on vacation, I can easily read 6 books at the same time :p The only thing we have in common is highlighting and I sometimes draft my blog post. If I feel like it.
I also write my reviews when I want to. Yesterday, I wrote 3 in a row. I write in a notebook while reading and that is basically a sketch for my review. So when I’m done and I don’t feel like writing my review already, I just wait a couple of days and then I sit down and write some with my notes. I don’t like to feel pressure to write a review. They always end up feeling forced and that’s not something I want to publish.
My system is not quite as organized as yours, but I do pick my reading list for the week, and read one book at a time. I have to post my review before picking up the next book, and I post on Amazon, Goodreads, and one of my blogs. Also on FB.
I completely understand the need for a system.
I don’t draft my post ahead of time, but that sounds brilliant. Maybe I should try that out. I also use the HTML sometimes, partly because the Blogger editor is crap, and I have a hard time moving images to where I want them to be, so I have to upload images manually through html.
Wow, that makes me a super spontaneous reader and blogger because I read whatever I like after finishing a book, no reading lists for me, lol! I also write my draft review immediately after finishing but not in WP. I will take a while to clean up and type the final review into WP when I have a quiet moment since when I first write the draft, it may be at work, on the bus or in bed… anywhere!
One thing though, I do type up my posts in the HTML editor, it just gives me better control! 🙂
Just wow.. really! This post sounds soo much like me! Several of things when it comes to the reading of the book to the process of making sure there’s a drafted post ready for my review, it’s just.. yea. I guess I’m very “OCD” about my reviewing/blogging, but I see no shame. Damn! I think I’d consider myself extremely organized.
Wow that’s awesome that you’re able to stick to such a regimented routine. I’d like to try to have one, but, honestly, if I was that structured it would kill the enjoyment of reading. There are some things I always do, like search for a quote to use and take mental notes/write down notes upon finishing, but that’s about it.
On the one hand, I wish I could write reviews right upon finish a book, but that’s not how my mind works. I need time to process and really think about how the book made me feel and what I liked/disliked, and that cannot be done immediately upon finishing.
It’s so interesting reading about what works for other book bloggers!
I actually have about the same system for my stuff. I can’t read two books at once, and I can’t start a new one until I have reviewed the last one. I do have to wait at least 2 hours after I finish the book before I can write my review. I find that otherwise, I give it a higher rating than I really wanted to. I have a few that I have read and left them a 5 star review based on the ending high I have from finishing just to have to go back and revise the review and change the rating because everything will come rushing back to me and I will realize everything that was wrong with the book and made me actually not like it.
Oh, and I also hand-code my posts. I just got set up with the CBB plugin, but before that, when I was still on blogger, I had the posts set up to auto include my format coding so I didn’t have to hand-code the top section each time. But font formatting and line breaks and everything for the review itself are always done in the moment.
Isn’t it a bit counterproductive to post the review on Goodreads before it’s on the blog? I’m a relatively new blogger, so I’m not sure how that would affect your blog traffic and whatnot.
But yes, I AM really OCD about reviewing. After I finish a book, I try to make a “draft” of the review, and schedule it for the blog. I usually wait a few days, in case I change my mind on how I felt about the book and whatnot.
Putting my review on Goodreads first doesn’t affect my traffic in a negative way, and it’s helpful to other bloggers if I do that. 🙂 For example, if I read an ARC 3 months early, I’m not going to post it on my blog right away because publishers prefer if you wait until 1 month before release date. But I will post it on Goodreads because early reviews on Goodreads can help a blogger decide whether or not they’d like to request that book to review themselves!
And I still get plenty of comments on my blog reviews, even if the review has already been on Goodreads for a while. In fact, a lot of people will read both!
I can relate to about 90% of your list. I try not to start a new book (especially not a new book in a series) before writing a review at least. Though a lot of the time I can’t help but read other random books. Especially if the review I’m working on is difficult.
I don’t have a set way of reading an blogging… I tr to read a book and write my review but life always gets in my way:( I am so incredibly behind in writing my reviews that I may actually NOT write reviews for the ones I keep putting off… I need to figure out a better system though! Great post thanks!
Omg…this is me. I am so anal. My friends tease me but I have a system a beautiful wonderful system. I always set up my post before I read and write review within 24 hrs. I use my calendar for everything and it’s color coded. I have a complete system for how I share it with websites and my site’s social media. *passes you a cup of coffee* you rock!
That is awesome! 😀 Being that organized totally rocks! *high five*
I’m not organized at all when it comes to my blog. Maybe I should follow in your lead, because right now I have 14 reviews I should have written before but still haven’t started. Agh! Haha. It’s ridiculous, really. I read a lot of books at once because, no matter how much I like the book, sometimes I just need a break from it. Of course, there are the books that I just never put down and I write the reviews fairly soon after I finish them. I love it when that happens, but I don’t feel like I could do it with every book. *shrugs*
As for visual vs. HTML editors: I use both… sort of. I’m mostly an HTML editor girl because I have more control over the post that way. SOMETIMES, though, I use visual. Usually when entering pictures and links (only when there’s a ton) and things like that. I’m not sure why… I think it’s an anti-clutter thing. I don’t feel like looking at all the code while I’m putting it in, so I go to visual until I need to fine-tune. For the most part I use the HTML editor, though. It’s my preferred.
I WISH I had your habits. I sometimes end up having to reread books so I can properly review them. This is because I often have 4-5 books going at once, and though I try hard, I cannot always write a review right after finishing. What I usually do is start a doc, jot down a rating and some notes, and slowly plug away until I finish a review.
I want to try much harder to be more organized, because I think I’d free up some time for myself if I did. And feel more professional about blogging/reviewing.
I do use the HTML editor. Cannot stand the other one! And I often type tags into my reviews as I’m doing them, so I don’t miss them later when transferring the review between GDocs/Wordpress.
I’m the same way! I can’t read more than one book at a time and I really can’t read another book without writing the review of the previous one. Although sometimes I may start the next book, but I never finish it before writing that review.
For the other stuff I can’t relate, especially the HTML thing! Though it sounds so cool. I wish I knew more about coding so I could have more control over my blog layout.
Great post, Ashley!
Wow, that is a very strict routine haha. I share some of the same steps, such as posting a review immediately after I finish a book, and only reading one book at a time. But I hardly ever schedule posts or draft posts in advanced. Definitely not as organised as you are!